Playback levels

[Les Green]

I have a playback programmed on a Zero 88 Solution XL. I can add an extra lantern by putting the fader up to the level I require then RECORD>MERGE. I can’t remove a lantern or reduce its intensity. I used to be able to do this by moving the requisite fader to maximum then reducing it to the required intensity or zero then RECORD>MERGE. I am guessing it is operator error rather than a desk problem. Any ideas?

[Les Green]

I am having a problem on a Zero88 Solution XL desk. Trying to modify a stored playback. How do I change one of the programmed lanterns to a reduced output. I used to raise the relevant lantern fader to maximum then reduce it to the level I needed or zero to delete the lantern from the playback. Now I can only increase the level, not lower it. Any ideas?

[thierry]

Hi,

Raise your playback to full, then adjust your fixture (being LTP mode), then push the "update" button and the playback involved.

[Edward Z88]

Hi @Les Green

Welcome to the forum.

I believe my colleague Keith has replied to your email regarding this.

18 hours ago, Les Green said:

I can’t remove a lantern or reduce its intensity. I used to be able to do this by moving the requisite fader to maximum then reducing it to the required intensity or zero

23 minutes ago, thierry said:

(being LTP mode)

I think @thierry has hit the nail on the head - you'll need to make sure your channel faders are in "LTP" mode, rather than "HTP" mode. When in LTP mode, the channel faders can be used to reduce the levels of intensities active in cues. When in HTP mode, the channel faders mix with the active cues, rather than override them. The Channel Mix Mode can be set from the SPECIAL MFKs.

18 hours ago, Les Green said:

I can add an extra lantern by putting the fader up to the level I require then RECORD>MERGE

As a side note, we would recommend using the UPDATE key when adding/removing lights from an existing cue. To do this, go into a cue, make your changes, tap UPDATE, and then tap the playback's GO button.

Hope this helps.

[Les Green]

All sorted now. Thanks for your help. I am a relative beginner and I didn’t know about LTP!

[Edward Z88]

10 minutes ago, Les Green said:

All sorted now. Thanks for your help. I am a relative beginner and I didn’t know about LTP!

No problem at all - really pleased to hear that solved the issue. Let us know if there's anything else we can help with.

[Roodie]

On 11/14/2023 at 5:11 PM, Les Green said:

All sorted now. Thanks for your help. I am a relative beginner and I didn’t know about LTP!

The LTP setting brings its own problems though, and is - in my opinion - more complicated to use than HTP.

What you can do in HTP mode to lower an intensity in a recorded playback is:

- raise your playback to full

- press "special" (mfk)

- press "page up" (mfk) to go to the second page of special keys. Now you should see just numbers and an @ and "through" etc. on the mfk displays.

- enter the number of the channel you want to lower

- it should be controllable by the rightmost wheel now.

- set the intensity with the wheel to what it should be

- press "update", then the playback flash button.  (or: "record" and the playback flash)

- press clear several times.  (don't press clear before you saved the changes as it will undo the changes)

 

Personally I like that method better than using LTP mode. I hope this helps a little.  :-)

 

 

[kgallen]

Crikey, that's a mouthful!

On FLX I type 18@50 UPDATE ENTER.

HTP is largely unusable unless all you have in your rig is generics.

[Roodie]

1 minute ago, kgallen said:

HTP is largely unusable unless all you have in your rig is generics.

Hm...we do...  😄

We often have several new groups performing in our theatre, so their technicians will not be used to working with the Solution desk. We want it to be as uncomplicated as possible for them.

 

[kgallen]

Just now, Roodie said:

Hm...we do...  😄

We often have several new groups performing in our theatre, so their technicians will not be used to working with the Solution desk. We want it to be as uncomplicated as possible for them.

In which case I can see HTP is more familiar to them!

But it will hamper you significantly if your install develops. It's a bit like tracking, before getting the FLX it was a nightmare...

[Roodie]

What are develops?  (sorry, I'm not very familiar with the terminology)

(also tracking is invented by Satan)  😄

[kgallen]

36 minutes ago, Roodie said:

What are develops?  (sorry, I'm not very familiar with the terminology)

What I mean is, if you start installing LED fixtures or movers. Or even just colour scrollers or gobo rotators.

At such point when you have more than just dimmers, then HTP won't really work as a strategy. LTP and tracking will almost certainly come into play.

I don't know what tracking is like on Solution - maybe it's more awkward than on FLX. Prior to getting my FLX I ran a mile from tracking, but now it's just on by default. But then again now I have LED and movers in addition to generics so it's a bit of a "must" since I exploit move on dark a lot and sometimes overlay other playbacks or UDKs.

[Roodie]

2 hours ago, kgallen said:

What I mean is, if you start installing LED fixtures or movers. Or even just colour scrollers or gobo rotators.

At such point when you have more than just dimmers, then HTP won't really work as a strategy. LTP and tracking will almost certainly come into play.

Ah, thanks!  Yes, if HTP/LTP also refers to things like position etc. I can see that I'd run into problems then.

Quote

I don't know what tracking is like on Solution - maybe it's more awkward than on FLX. Prior to getting my FLX I ran a mile from tracking, but now it's just on by default. But then again now I have LED and movers in addition to generics so it's a bit of a "must" since I exploit move on dark a lot and sometimes overlay other playbacks or UDKs.

I don't know either to be honest... - that's the first thing I convinced our technical director to turn off... But we only have dimmers and some LED-Bars and no moving lights or something where it would be important to keep your positions.  I was joking because I once sat on a lighting desk which I think had tracking enabled, and I didn't know what it was or how to deal with it and went into a "it-doesn't-do-what-I'm-telling-it-to-do!!!"-rage...  It's probably very convenient for more complicated lights (so who knows if I'll try it at some point...).

[kgallen]

I would have thought on ZerOS and the Solution, if it was on you wouldn’t notice.

Possibly the main thing for your current workflow would be if you use Update, then ensure you have Cue Only selected. 
 

Move on Dark is also very useful for old-skool colour scrollers. That’s where if first used it. 
 

I’d encourage you to play with tracking on if you have a bit of down time. I bet you wouldn’t realise, and it will put you in a better position in future. 

[Roodie]

Good point - thank you!

[Edward Z88]

On 12/3/2023 at 5:18 AM, kgallen said:

I don't know what tracking is like on Solution

Tracking behaviour on Solution is identical to FLX.

On 12/3/2023 at 7:28 AM, Roodie said:

Yes, if HTP/LTP also refers to things like position etc. I can see that I'd run into problems then.

The HTP/LTP option on the Solution Special MFKs is only related to the channel faders. As these control intensity, it is not related to Colour, Beam, or Position.

More information on Tracking here...

https://www.zero88.com/manuals/zeros/cues-playbacks/record-options/tracking