USB Saving Problems on FLX

[van den abbeele Eric]

Hello,

I've been on 7.11 almost since it was released on FLX. I did a lot of shows.
At least two a week, sometimes 3 or 4... And until yesterday I never had any particular worries. Often used the same configuration by deleting the Cues, adding or removing some fixtures... Made backups so as to always have on USB keys, the state of things and when a show was encoded, to make another backup to avoid starting all over again.

Yesterday during the USB backup (before the show of this weekend) I had the impossibility of being able to record on the USB keys, message in red on the screen (Key Zero88 supplied having my first FLX)
Fortunately for a few weeks, I had taken the habit of having a second USB key which worked without worries.

After cleaning, and removing a certain number of files from the Zero88 Keys, I was able to use it again... (And the messages in red indicating on the FLX screen, the impossibility of recording on the USB keys have disappeared...

So I have some questions and advice to ask.

In fact I avoid leaving the face front key base, because always afraid in a bad gesture too fast, to tear it off.

But on the other hand there remains a port available on the right side of the FLX.

I'm thinking of using this one... maybe safer... Then on futur month I had the idea of using a USB HUB (I don't know which brand... Having direction ?)
But already to limit the wear of the connector on front panel or on side, to use a 50 cm USB extension to remove and replace the keys on the female part of this extension...

But my question is about the backup, maybe using SSD disks which would be more reliable...
What do you think ?
More reliable than USB keys?

Of course, ideally, I would like to have a backup with ZerOS Server, but often the installation of the FLX, projectors and all the hardware is often already done in a hurry, and configuring an additional server seems to me to be complicated to do it calmly... Then it's yet another expense...

And for the moment there is already the change of the projectors...

How long do you do your backups?

On the FLX side, do you often find yourself in trouble?
Show unusable?

In any case, my experience apart from this problem of backup with USB keys, since 2019, in 7.9.7, then in 7.10, and recently 7.11, I have never had any problems.

I find that there is a general stability and everything works well.

 

 

Have a nice day and thank you all.

[kgallen]

When plugged into FLX front panel or via a USB hub in rear port I haven't had an issue with USB sticks (Zero88 or other branded) becoming unusable or corrupted. Aside: The issue I do have, is since the USB sockets are not labelled on the FLX, is knowing which of the USB keys is associated with the port name provided by the GUI.

I have had issues with USB sticks (including a Zero88 one) being corrupted and becoming unusable when connected to a Windows10 machine, but not when connected to FLX.

I don't believe an SSD card would be any more reliable. The underlying Flash memory technology is the same, only the interface is different, and I don't have any reason to trust SSD over USB.

[van den abbeele Eric]

Thank for your answers dear Kgallen…

 

so I will continue to use USB key… I didn’t know what was the problem & I did n’y have a phone near me for taking photo !

so one key was impossible to use & second key was ok 

I don’t know if it was a internal problem or perhaps only this USB keys that was suddenly corrupted ….

but after Mac cleaning all was ok !

i will see this afternoon if it s ok or not ….

performance tonight & tomorrow 

[van den abbeele Eric]

I See some différents notice about USB Keys & SSD...

 

"Yes, it's normal to have the impression that USB keys snap faster than other flash memories. On the one hand because we abuse them by savagely removing them from computers, on the other hand because they are for many equipped with the most economical, slowest and most unreliable type of memory over time (TLC), and that they do not benefit from the write optimizations of their SSD cousins.
These are sort of poor quality SSDs, which we are sure will die prematurely. They should therefore absolutely not be used as a permanent backup medium. They have the advantage of being compact and economical, but in terms of security over time, nothing still beats a good old external hard drive.

[kgallen]

Eric,

Coming back to your initial question: I agree I would not use a USB stick for "long term" storage. I copy the show files from the USB stick onto my PC which as a RAID NAS attached. The USB stick is purely a mechanism to get data to and from the FLX and my main computer. In this respect, it's adequate.

Maybe I interpreted your initial question wrong. USB sticks are of course a portable medium. SSD (in terms of the solid-state HDD replacement) is more usually semi-permanently attached inside a computer - they usually have some version of SATA interface. This isn't hot-pluggable in the way that USB memory sticks are, so "SSD" wouldn't be a replacement for USB on the FLX.

Kevin

[van den abbeele Eric]

Thank for your answers Kevin.

 

It is clear that if on MAC and PC Window, there is a mechanism which allows to properly eject a USB medium and others.

On the FLX, this ejection mechanism does not exist like PC/MAC...

But maybe the simple fact of leaving the Save or Load menu, finally makes it possible to consider ejecting the USB keys or SSD disk... Without risking major worries... It would be interesting to ask the question to Jon, or Edward to find out more more about the possibilities of backups when we don't have ZerOS server...

[van den abbeele Eric]

Hello Edward & Jon,

Can you explain a bit how "SETUP" works and the "Save" and "Load" options concerning the "USB keys", "SSD disk" and "Hard disks" media?

When using this kind of support on Windows as on Mac, it is important to properly eject everything that is connected to avoid problems & having crash...

 

What about ZerOS when using media through the FLX's USB ports...

Is it possible to use SSD disk or HDD Disk without clean Eject ?

Have you some other Advice ?

 

Thank you for the info...

 

Eric

[Edward Z88]

Hi Eric,

All information on saving show files to USB storage is available here...

https://zero88.com/manuals/zeros/setup/save

There is no option to manually eject a USB storage device in ZerOS. Just make sure you don't unplug a USB drive in the middle of loading or saving - particularly when loading software updates!

Edward

[kgallen]

4 hours ago, Edward Z88 said:

All information on saving show files to USB storage is available here...

https://zero88.com/manuals/zeros/setup/save

Side topic - Edward could you improve the document to explain Save Setup Only and Save Setup & Palettes. They are mentioned but there is no description of what "Setup" information is - of course I could guess but the documentation needs to be explicit and say what is (and isn't included). Palettes is hopefully more obvious but I think the documentation should still be more explicit, if nothing else, to mention anything in this scope that is excluded. For example are the picture images included in Colour Palettes? A contrived example I admit, but this is exactly why the documentation does actually need to say and not assume.

 

[Edward Z88]

Hi Kevin,

All very valid comments. Hopefully this clears things up...

https://zero88.com/manuals/zeros/setup/save

Let me know your thoughts.

Edward

[kgallen]

2 hours ago, Edward Z88 said:

Let me know your thoughts.

Fantastic 🙂👍

Save Setup & Palettes: This options saves everything EXCEPT cues and UDKs.

So as a tester: this would include user MACRO definitions? 🙃

[van den abbeele Eric]

Hello, 

 

thank for information Edward.

limitation or problems with SSD or Hard disk usb device ?

is it better to keep usb device connected on FLX ? Or better to eject ?

Thank for your help & advice 

 

eric 
 

[Edward Z88]

Hi Kevin,

15 hours ago, kgallen said:

So as a tester: this would include user MACRO definitions? 🙃

No it wouldn't! Manual updated!

11 hours ago, van den abbeele Eric said:

limitation or problems with SSD or Hard disk usb device ?

is it better to keep usb device connected on FLX ? Or better to eject ?

There is not really a right or wrong approach. Personally, I like to use one of the "mini" USB drives that are basically just a USB connector, to ensure they can't accidentally get snapped off. I then leave this plugged into the console for all of my show file storage, essentially as internal storage. If there are occasions where I need to transfer files to and from a PC, I would often use a different USB drive.

Edward

[kgallen]

2 hours ago, Edward Z88 said:

No it wouldn't! Manual updated!

🤣😜👍

[Stacey Harvey]

Good morning everyone, 

I found myself on this forum as I'm having issues with backing up show files on an FLX24. The USB drive is not recognised regardless of which port it is connected to. I would like to update the firmware on the desk as it's well overdue but obviously I'd rather not lose everything that's been punched in. Has anyone had issues with backing up on an FLX?

Stacey

[Stacey Harvey]

...Fixed the issue by hitting the refresh button

 

👍

[Edward Z88]

Hi @Stacey Harvey

Welcome to the Zero 88 Forum.

2 hours ago, Stacey Harvey said:

...Fixed the issue by hitting the refresh button

Pleased to hear you were able to save your show file to a USB drive.

If there's anything we can help with just let us know.

Edward