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Remote Switches

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I own a standard Frog console and use it for theatre work. I want to use an external foot-pedal as GO-funktion. Does someone know how the remote switches / pins are used? (maybe I'm too stupid, but I didn't find it in the manual)

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See page 8-2 of the manual HERE for the pinout detail of the connector. Page 6-10 tells you how to then configure the switches in Super User to do something useful.

 

In the latest software you can simulate the effect of the 6 remote switches by plugging in a keyboard, holding CTRL and pressing F1-F6. This might prove useful in diagnosing any problems.

 

Best of luck!

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I cannot find the remotes anywhere,for a fat frog , we were focusing for our show i was in our box, communication was difficult to say the least

Thanks

Ryan

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As it stands, your best move is to make one; I don't think zero actually sell them.

 

It's not terribly hard to do if you have a little electronic knowhow; either get a receiver, a transmitter, an encoder and a decoder and get out the soldering iron, or bodge apart a wireless doorbell... I made one which cost me about £40 to put together and has up to 15 signal combinations; well over the 6 remote gos you get on the desk.

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having read the manual, to trigger a remote switch, you jsut have to short the pin to ground.

however im wanting to create a remote control, which will have LED's on it, which will light when a switch is pressed. the electronics to do this im happy with, but this would also result in connecting the remote pin, through a battery (say, 3volts), through the led, through the switch and back into ground.

 

would putting a battery in the connection damage the desk, or have any effect on the operation of the remote switch?

 

thanks,

matt

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Best thing really would be to use a double pole switch. Failing that, add a diode between the switch and the remote pin (anode at the remote pin side), so that none of the battery current can go to the desk.

 

So (excusing the dodgy picture)...

 

Battery+ -> Resistor -> (A)LED(K) -
								\
								 -> Switch -> GND
								/
Remote Pin -> (A)Diode(K)----------

 

Not sure without trying it, if the desk will still recognise the switch closure with the extra diode volt drop in there. But you might get away with it. Let us know how you get on!

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i used a relay. connecting the led indicators to the relay control part. and using the relais pins to actually make the connection. this way making the connection is completely safe.

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I'm not sure where to put this post so I'm hoping I may get some answers here...

 

Simply - Is there a remote availible for the Fat Frog?

 

I am in the situation of having to lug my desk about and it has been suggested that I may be able to get/ buy a remote for it. So I can leave it in the box and punch buttons down on the stage to get the lanterns on that I want.

 

Does this exist? I can't see anything in the zero 88 product range but I'm not sure exactly what I'm looking for! If not does anyone have any other helpful suggestions as to what i can use???

 

thanks

 

eldar

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Hi, Eldar

I posted a similar topic here is the reply

 

As it stands, your best move is to make one; I don't think zero actually sell them.

 

It's not terribly hard to do if you have a little electronic knowhow; either get a receiver, a transmitter, an encoder and a decoder and get out the soldering iron, or bodge apart a wireless doorbell... I made one which cost me about £40 to put together and has up to 15 signal combinations

 

Cheers

Ryan

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Hi,

 

I do most of my lighting on my own and as a result whenever I'm focusing lamps I either have to find someone available to bring up the sliders when I shout down from the stage or run up and down the venue and up and down ladders to fade up different lights.

 

Enough was enough - this takes far too much time and I'm not getting any younger!

 

So, I got myself an RF transmitter/reciever from eBay. Mine is only a 2 channel version but you can get them with up to 7 channels easily - It cost me <£20 and even came in a case with a key fob transmitter. Add a 12V power supply and simply wire in the DC power and the outputs to a DIN plug for the Frog remote inputs and hey presto, a very simple wireless remote.

 

I then set up a series of memories to represent channels 1-48 and configure one of the remote inputs to go to the start of this memory stack and the other as a standard GO button. This allows me to stay up the ladder and focus, stepping through the channels as it suits me and returning back to channel 1 easily when I need to (eg when cross over to the other side of the stage to do it all again or if I'm only rigging a 6 or 12 channel rig) - all from my little keyfob!

 

A must have time saver in my opinion and I wish I would have done it sooner :D

 

Hopefully this will be of use to some of you folk. Any questions give me a shout.

 

Andrew.

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I see that you have worked out how to make a remote for the fat frog, i am curious about the detail of HOW you made it?? Please could you go into a little more detail or PM me so that i may emabark on this endeavour. Cheers

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Right, ok... Remote... First of all, neither I nor Zero88 nor anyone else accepts any liability/responsibility for anything stupid you do to yourself (soldering iron and that), your desk, or anything you've bought/own/anything else in the world, and I don't guarantee that this will work, or be safe, but it worked for me. Unfortunately I'm in America at the mo, away from my original wiring diagrams and stuff, but I'll put together what I did for you :)

 

That out of the way:

 

If you just want one Remote Go on one submaster, you could just get a wireless doorbell and hack it up, so that instead of a bell, you just have a relay across two pins of an 8-pin DIN which goes in the Remote Go port on the Fat Frog. I decided I wanted all 6 remote gos, so I did a bit more...

 

Here's what I did:

 

Kit list:

1x TX, 1x RX (Radio Frequency transmitter and receiver). I used these ones from Maplin, which are AM and work at 433MHz: Click, Datasheet. These are the things that actually transmit the data. Anything similar should do the job, but the specifics for wiring them and exactly what else you'll need will be slightly different.

 

1x Encoder, 1x Decoder. I used these ones, also from Maplin, which are made by the same company: Click. Again, anything similar should work, but your wiring will need to be different (like these need certain resistors and certain voltages on certain pins).

 

2x Antennae are handy, I used these. Flexi are better than Heli, but Heli are smaller. You'll also need two little nuts to screw them in to, I think those use M4 but I could be wrong.

 

Some way of inputting what Go you want (I used four sub-mini STSP switches to set the 4 inputs).

 

Some momentary switch to "send".

 

1x "Transmit" LED, which indicates when the transmitter is transmitting (you can skip this if you want)

 

2x 5ish V power supplies (I used 3V for my transmitter and 4.5 for my receiver, on 2 and 3 AA batteries, respectively)

 

1x "Status" LED for the receiver

 

2x 1KOhm resistors

 

1x 15KOhm resistor

 

1x 22KOhm resistor

 

1x Low battery LED for the receiver (optional)

 

1x "Learn" switch

 

If you want up to 4 Remote Gos, you just need 4 reed relays. If you want more, you need as many relays as you want Gos, and you need some logic gates to sort out the binary signal you're transmitting. I can go into detail on that if you need.

 

Then you just need to wire them vaguely according to the diagrams in this.

 

I wired my encoder like this:

Power supply - momentary switch to send data

Then, between pins 1-4 and the momentary switch, I had my switches to select the Remote Go you wanted (I used a binary system, so pin 1's switch was the 1 column, pin 2's the 2 column, pin 3's the 4 column and pin 4's the 8 column.

Pin 5 goes to the power supply ground.

Pin 6 goes straight to the Data In on the TX unit (ignore the amplifyer they have on their datasheet). It was pin 3 on my TX (see the TX datasheet)

Pin 7 connects to the annode (positive, longer leg) of the transmit LED if you're using one, and the cathode (negative, shorter leg) goes to the power supply.

Pin 8 goes straight to the momentary switch.

 

Then I wired my receiver like this:

1, 2, 17, 18: Outputs to logic/relays

3: Low battery LED (I skipped that)

4: 15KOhm resistor

5: Power supply ground

6: No connection

7: 22KOhm resistor to ground

8: No connection

9: Data Out from RX (pin 14 on mine, see that datasheet)

10: This one's a bit awkward. See the RX datasheet for the schematic, but basically:

VCC (power supply) - Status LED - Learn switch - Power Supply Ground

									|

							 1 KOhm Resistor

									|

							   Pin 10

11: No Connection

12: Ground

13: VCC (Power supply)

14: VCC (Power supply)

15: No Connection

16: No Conncetion

 

Then you just wire your relays across the relevant pins in a male 8-pin DIN plug (see the back of the Frog manual for the schematic) and you're set!

 

There's a bit about learning the transmitter, that you can read about in the data sheets, but when you've soldered that all up you're pretty much ready to roll! I'm assuming you have some electronic know-how here, if that's not the case, I can try to give a more basic guide :) Hope it's been helpful, any questions just shout!

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Thankyou very much, i will look forward to building and trying this device, the practicality is excellence!! Don't worry i myself won't build it, i will pass this info on to our tech department who will work there magic!!

 

Thanks again

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[The pictures I attached at the time have gone missing since the move to the new forum format.]

 

Thanks for the tips on making a remote...

 

If I've done it right, there should be a couple of pictures of my concoction below. I've based it on the HIRK-433 Hybrid Receiver module (N87BN) and 3-button key fob (RN57M) from Maplin. I've used opto-isolators (CY94C) rather than relays to trigger the remote inputs on the FatFrog (thanks Paul for the necessary electrical info). It's powered from the desk lamp socket (using a 7805 voltage regulator circuit inside the remote unit) and by modifying an XLRM-F adaptor from CPC (CN00111) the desk lamp can be mounted at the same time the remote unit is plugged in. With output and 'thru' locking DIN8 sockets for the remote connection to the FatFrog, as they say, job's-a-good-'un!

 

By setting up the first three remote switches as 'go next', 'go 1' and 'go --' whilst focusing (on my own - sigh!) at the other end of the hall on top of a scaffold tower I can step through preset memories, return to the first or go to DBO without having to climb up and down the scaffold and walk back to the desk for each lantern!

 

Parts List (4-channel unit):

("e.g." if I already had the component in my bits box, but I've suggested a suitable part)

 

1x HIRK-433 Hybrid Rx module (Maplin N87BN)

1x 3-button key fob (Maplin RN57M)

1x Flexi antenna (Maplin LL80B)

4x SFH618-2 opto isolator (Maplin CY94C)

4x 150 ohm resistor (Maplin M150R) [in series with opto anodes]

4x 100 ohm resistor (Maplin M100R) [in series with opto isolator collector]

1x Push switch (Maplin FH91Y) [Learn]

4x Green LED 5mm (e.g Maplin WL28F) [channel indication]

1x Red LED 5mm (e.g Maplin WL27E) [power]

1x 220 ohm resistor (Maplin M220R) [in series with Power LED]

1x Yellow LED 5mm (e.g. Maplin WL30H) [status]

6x 5mm LED clips (e.g Maplin YY40T)

1x DIP2 PCB switch [optional: Link1/Link2 configuration]

5x 0 ohm links (or bits of resistor leg!)

 

For the power supply part of the circuit (preceeded by a bridge rectifier as I wasn't convinced the Desk Lamp output would be DC!)

1x 7805 Voltage regulator (e.g Maplin CH35Q)

2x 100nF ceramic capacitor

1x 22uF 63V electrolytic capacitor

1x 47uF 16V electrolytic capacitor

1x Bridge Rectifier (I used RS 261-328 but any would do!) (e.g. Maplin AQ94C)

2x 1nF ceramic capacitor [decoupling of HIRK-433 analogue and digital supplies]

1x 4.7uF 16V electrolytic capacitor [decoupling of HIRK-433 digital supply]

I also used an in-line 100mA fuse.

 

1x XLR3M chassis plug (e.g. Maplin BW92A)

2x Locking DIN8 sockets (CPC CN00765)

2x 8-pin PCB headers [remote connections]

9x 2-pin PCB headers [LEDs, switches etc]

1x 1-pin header [aerial connection]

1x ABS project box 120mm x 100mm x 45mm (Maplin LH22Y)

7/0.2 and/or strips of rainbow ribbon cable for wiring up LEDs, switches etc

heat-shrink tubing

M3 and M4 screws, nuts, washers, spacers

solder!

 

To make an 8-pin 'standard analogue control cable' for connection between remote unit and FatFrog remote input:

2x Locking DIN8 in-line plugs (CPC CN00753)

8-core cable (e.g. CAT5 ethernet cable)

 

To make a power cable from FatFrog desk lamp socket:

1x XLR3M-XLR3F (CPC CN00111) [drilled in the centre to take a piece of 2-core cable]

1x XLR3F in-line plug

2 core flexible cable

 

I made my own single-sided PCB using dry transfers onto a piece of Maplin WF38R and using WF10L etching fluid. (Scale pdf of the layout attached to this post.)

 

[As per the original poster, you use this information at your own risk! (But mine works nicely!)]

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If anyone is feeling lazy, the people who make the modules used above make complete units. I've just bought one of these...

DSC00053.JPG

...which is a 3 output unit. Available from CPC in the UK under part number RF00017. This is an AM unit but they also do FM units and units with different numbers of outputs.

 

I'll update this post when I've had a chance to wire it in.

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The receiver unit with an XLR4 male connector added for power input and a flying lead to the locking DIN to connect to the remote socket on the desk...

RXOpen.jpg

The front of the unit...

RXFront.jpg

For the power supply I tapped ontp the back of my desk light, making a cable clamp in the side of the connector. I didn't go the inline adaptor route as detailed above as it felt a bit flimsy....

PSU.jpg

The unit plugged up at the back of the desk...

InUse.jpg

 

I hope this is of use. If anyone needs any more details then please ask.

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so how is the din wired? does it look for connection between pins(use a relay), or do you need to chuck 12v into it(use transistors) or what?

 

Thanks

SMence

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It's a simple contact closure - all you need to do is wire a push button between the required pins. The pin-out is stated in the back of the user manual.

 

Hope this helps,

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Some things you can try to diagnose the problem...

 

- Go to the menu Super User -> Desk Setup -> Remote Switches, and check the switches are enabled and configured how you want them. In the latest software you can simulate the effect of the 6 remote switches by plugging in a keyboard, holding CTRL and pressing F1-F6.

 

- Boot the desk into test mode (hold F1 while the desk is booting). Use the channel flash buttons to select the Remote Switches test page on the LCD, then try closing your switches. You should see the mimic on the LCD which will tell you that the hardware is working OK.

 

Let us know how you get on.

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I assume that you have configured the required remote switches to be GO or Go to memory number in Desk Setup ? :P

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I was browsing the settings today through super user and for some reason had a peek at 'desk defaults'...

turns out my version of the desk OS has a y/n setting for remote switches in desk defaults...

All good now... controlling the desk with 6 buttons over 30m of ethernet cable...

 

Thanks for making the desk so upgradeable by the way... with remote, and fixture updates and customization...

And I couldn't live without the vga monitor...

 

I have to disagree with everyone who thinks they are hard to use as well...

 

Thanks

SMence

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The behaviour of the remote switches is configured in the menu:

 

Super User -> Desk Setup -> Remote Switches

 

The default is for switch 1 to perform a GO. You can configure each of the 6 remote switches to perform a GO, or a GO to a specified memory number.

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