HELP!! Frog 2 First Timer....

[samcoombes]

Please help guys!

 

we are hiring in a Frog 2 for our Production in July.

 

We currently use a Fat Frog, and I will only have 4 days or so to get used to, and programme up the Frog 2.

 

I'll be using about 72 Generic channels, 12 moving heads, 12 colour scrollers, 2 haze, and 2 smoke machines.

 

my question is, am I being stupid? Will i need more time than this to get used to it and programme it up? I'm very confident with programming the Fat Frog, but I'd imagine the Frog 2 is a whole new ball game....

 

Please advise!!!!

 

Thanks

[K-Nine]

The Frog 2 desk is more complex and powerful than the Frog series but a lot of elements are the same, particularly with how you program moving lights (select fixtures, select attribute, use control wheels to set values etc.)

 

Read the Quick Start section of the Manual (and the rest of it if you have the time or the inclination)

 

For new features that have been added since Release 2 of the desk software read the forum and associated release notes.

 

If you have any questions on certain functions or want to know how to achieve something please feel free to post in this forum

[samcoombes]

i've got the quick start guide....

 

Programming fixtures etc seems fine, but how about the generic stuff? Do i just choose the dimmer pack i need and then just use the faders for each channels?

 

Amazingly it seems the simplest functions are the ones worrying me!!!

 

Thanks K-Nine.

[K-Nine]

Generic (dimmer) channels are treated as fixtures on the Frog 2 desk. In the Fixture Schedule when you are adding fixtures select <CONVENTIONALS> from the Manufacturer and Dimmer from the fixture type and then enter the number of dimmer channels you have, eg 48.

 

I have found it much easier when programming cues etc if you have unique fixture numbers for all the generics/dimmers and moving lights. You assign fixture numbers to the fixtures in your schedule via the Edit Fixtures Window in Setup.

 

eg In our demo room we have 48 channels of dimming, four minimacs, two MAC 250s, MAC 500 and MAC 600.

 

I have numbered my dimmers 1- 48, the minimacs 101-104, the MAC 250s are 201 and 202, the MAC 500 is 501 and the MAC 600 is 601.

 

When selecting the dimmers/fixtures to program you can then enter the fixture numbers directly, eg 1 THRU 12 ENTER selects the first 12 dimmer channels/generics, 101 AND 102 selects the first two minimacs etc.

 

You can also select groups of fixtures by pressing GROUP and then selecting the required group of fixtures (eg Dimmers, Minimacs) from the tool bar on the touch screen.

[samcoombes]

excellent, sounds fine then :-D

 

Hopefully the hire comapny can supply the Frog 2, so far they have only offered the Avol Pearl 2004 - now I imagine that's a whole new world!!!! :-(

 

Thanks K nine.

[Kirkup_xp]

If you have trouble sourcing a Frog2 for hire, let us know and we'll be able to put you in touch with companies who have them in hire stock.

[samcoombes]

right, think we've found somewhere to hire the desk....

 

Could you just elaborate on how cues are stored on the Frog 2.

 

With the Fat Frog, i'm used to having them numbers, so for example, my last show was just cues 1 to 124...

 

whats all this cue stcking business? Does it all work the same (ie. just keep pressing GO to the next cue?)

 

Sorry for all the stupid questions, but I want to get on top of this so I kind of know what i'm doing when the desk arrives!!

 

Thanks

[Kirkup_xp]

On the Frog2 you have 10 physical playback masters on the front panel. Each of these can be used to control an individual cue stack with up to 999 memories. These playback masters, 1 to 10, can be paged between 1 and 100. This means that you can create multiple complex cue stacks for particular songs, chases, etc. Any one of the cues can have macros assigned to it, individual fade and delay times per parameter of any fixture.

 

The basic command syntaxes for recording cues are:

 

RECORD 1/1 ENTER (records stack 1, cue 1)

1/1 TIME 5 ENTER (sets the fade time of all attributes on 1/1 to 5 seconds)

1/1 TIME COLOUR 3 ENTER (sets the fade time of all colour attributes to 3 seconds)

STACK 1 SETUP (opens the Stack1 setup window, enabling you to choose various options including move whilst dark and convert the cue stack to a chase).

LOAD 1/1 ENTER (reloads cue 1/1 into the programmer for editing)

UPDATE (updates the currently loaded cue)

 

One difference between the Fat Frogs and the Frog2 is the fact that you cannot program an individual step of a cue stack as a chase. Instead, you should program a memory which contains a macro to trigger the chase. Although at first this may seem a hinderance, it adds the much requested ability to have a 'look' running at the same time as a chase.

 

Hope this helps

 

 

 

Peter

[samcoombes]

hmmm, still very confused, but sure it will be easier once I have the desk here....

 

So in theory i could just use the cues the way I would if on a Fat Frog?

 

The desk is for a production of Jesus Christ Superstar, so there will be a few chases etc, bit worried about how to programme these in? Whats the Macro idea all about?

 

Say i had a scene set of generic channels, and i have 8 Mac 205's which I want to kind of 'chase' continuously, and change colour at the same time? how would I go about programming this?

 

thanks for all the help - it's much appreciated!

[Kirkup_xp]

I would probably program Stack 1 as my main cue stack, containing the cues to be called by the DSM. This would behave in much the same way as the Fat Frog.

 

For the cue you describe, I would program the generics into the memory within that state, then program the moving heads into one or two seperate cue stacks, setup as chases. The Macro just tells the desk that when you trigger the cue, it should also perform the commands specified - in this case, activating the two chases. The following cue (end of a song, for example) would then instruct the desk to 'release' the other running cue stacks.

[samcoombes]

ah i see, i think that makes sense...

 

Is there any kind of tutorials about, similar to the guide done by Sam Henderson on the Frog range?

 

Just as I get my head around one desk, we need to upgrade to a completely different one!!

 

Also do Zero88 do the free training courses on the Frog 2?

 

I've managed to use Phantom Frog2 to program a few memories, and all seems fine....

 

How do i, however, make (example) cue 3, fade into cue 4 over 6 seconds? Do i just change the fade time on every fixture to 6.0?

 

Also, i'm still not sure about this chase thing..... if i've got cues 1 to 10 on memory stack one, but want a chase to occur at cue 5, do i programme the chase in a different stack, then tell cue 5 in memory stack one to jump over to the other cue in memory stack 2?

 

Argh, confusing!!!

[Kirkup_xp]

How do i, however, make (example) cue 3, fade into cue 4 over 6 seconds? Do i just change the fade time on every fixture to 6.0?

You can do it that way, or you can type in 1/4 TIME 6 ENTER.

 

Also, i'm still not sure about this chase thing..... if ive got cues 1 to 10 on memory stck one, but want a chase to occur at cue 5, do i programme the chase in a different stack, then tell cue 5 in memory stack one to jump over to the other cue in memory stack 2?

I'm not sure whether the version of Phantom Frog2 on the website supports macros, yet. If it does, you'd enter the command "G2" in the macro column. You'll also need to ensure that the Stack 2 fader is at full if the chase on stack 2 contains any intensity information.

 

G2 is Go, Stack2

R2 is Release, Stack2

 

 

HTH

 

 

 

(Full details of Macros included below:)

 

• DM = Don’t move on dark - All Parameters

• DMB = Don’t move on dark – Beamshape Parameters

• DMC = Don’t move on dark – Colour Parameters

• DMP = Don’t move on dark – Position Parameters

• DMBC = Don’t move on dark – Beamshape and Colour Parameters

• DMBP = Don’t move on dark – Beamshape and Position Parameters

• DMCP = Don’t move on dark – Colour and Position Parameters

• GX= Go playback X on the current page.

• GP/F = Go playback F on Page P.

• SX = Pause playback X on the current page.

• RX = Release playback X on the current page.

• PX = Change the current page to X.

• TS/C = Trigger (Go) cue S/C.

• CX = Choose playback X (turn the select led on for playback X).

• NC = Go to Cue C in the same cue stack (does NOT trigger the cue)

• NS/C = Go to Cue C in cue stack S (does NOT trigger the cue)

 

 

Multiple commands can be entered on a single cue by following the commands with a colon ( : )

[samcoombes]

thanks for that, still sounds confusing, but as I said, think it will be easier when I have the real thing in front of me operating real lights!!

 

If only i could 'borrow' one for a week or so lol!

 

Thanks