Patching profile for a DMX relay

[Simonkbike]

Venue is community theatre group using Solution desk.

I've built this 4 channel DMX relay pack to switch on/off ancillary on-stage lights & effects which may be damaged by a dimmer output.  The unit activates with a DMX signal of 128-255.  What's the best way to patch this on my desk?

Background: My installation uses a rack of Chilli dimmers for the 15a lighting bar channels plus some Chilli relays (controlling a 13a socket at the end of each bar). As novices the relays channels were patched with "dimmer" profile to faders, but later, on advice, the same faders were re-patched using "video 1ch" profile which is switched via the Beam On/Off.  The fader is therefore redundant. Inspecting the Dmx output, the Beam On outputs a DMX value 127, ie not enough to activate the new relays (although apparently sufficient to activate the Chilli relays).

When I tried patching the new relays:

a) The desk wouldn't let me patch to a fixture channel above 48 so the pack will fill 4 more faders which they don't really need.

b) When I patched as "video 1ch", the Dmx output value at Beam On was 11. (Further, if I select a mix of Chilli relay channels and the new relays the output value is 11; it's only 127 when activating Chillis alone). 

I'd really like to move all the relays off the faders and patch as fixtures so I can switch with Beam On/Off.  I'd also need to set the Dmx output value above 127 when activated.

Thanks

Simon.

[kgallen]

You will probably find it easier to use and more flexible to just patch as individual dimmers. 
 

I’ve built fixture definitions in the past that treat relays as parameters under Beam. But now with a tracking console with move on dark, just patching as dimmer I find is much less hasstle.

[Edward Z88]

Hi @Simonkbike

On 1/13/2024 at 11:26 PM, Simonkbike said:

What's the best way to patch this on my desk?

I would recommend patching the relay channels as "Non-Dim" fixtures, which can be found under the "Generic" manufacturer in Add Fixtures. The nice thing about this, is there are two variants of this fixture - Default On and Default Off. For example, if you want the relay channel to be powered as soon as the console is active, you could patch a Default On. This would still provide the ability to then switch it off if required.

On 1/13/2024 at 11:26 PM, Simonkbike said:

The desk wouldn't let me patch to a fixture channel above 48 so the pack will fill 4 more faders which they don't really need.

On 1/13/2024 at 11:26 PM, Simonkbike said:

I'd really like to move all the relays off the faders and patch as fixtures so I can switch with Beam On/Off. 

I would recommend patching the Non Dim fixtures to the Solution's MFKs, which are numbered as fixtures 101 thru 300. Once patched, you can then select the Non Dim fixtures on the MFKs, and under BEAM, you'll see the ability to switch the "Connected Load" using an encoder wheel.

On 1/13/2024 at 11:26 PM, Simonkbike said:

I've built this 4 channel DMX relay pack to switch on/off ancillary on-stage lights & effects which may be damaged by a dimmer output. 

In the picture I can't see any fuses between each relay output and its respective socket. If you are plugging in devices with a 3-amp fuse in the plug this is fine, but it would be best practice to ensure there is protection, in the event of a load with a 13-amp fuse being plugged into a socket.

[Simonkbike]

Hi Edward,

Thanks for this, I'll look at non-dim fixtures tomorrow; sounds exactly what I was looking for if I can patch to mfks.

Couple of questions: 

What dmx value does this output?

What's the difference between video1ch and non-dim profiles? I recall we used video as it wasn't affected by the Master fader, but can be set in the cue stack when needed. That means I can power down the LEDs on a lighting bar & kill the fan noise if I'm only using my incandescents. 

FYI: The relay control unit is limited to 10amp max overall load and has 10amp fuse in the mains plug (not shown in photo) that provides power.  When I have time I'll label with max load for each socket.  We're using it to switch small effects devices & on-stage table lamps so not envisaging overload issues.

Cheers, S.

[Edward Z88]

12 hours ago, Simonkbike said:

What dmx value does this output?

The "Connected Load" parameter of the "Non Dim" fixtures can be set to any level between 0 and 255. It will default at either 0 or 255, depending on the "Non Dim" variant you patch.

12 hours ago, Simonkbike said:

What's the difference between video1ch and non-dim profiles? I recall we used video as it wasn't affected by the Master fader, but can be set in the cue stack when needed.

The "Video" fixture was an old "Generic" fixture from our legacy fixture library. This fixture is no longer included in the latest ZerOS Library. This fixture defaulted at a value of 127. This is problematic for controlling relays, as for some relays this is "on", but for others this value would be "off".

The "Connected Load" parameter of the "Non Dim" fixtures will not be affected by intensity masters such as the Grand Master, but can be recorded into cues.

12 hours ago, Simonkbike said:

When I have time I'll label with max load for each socket.  We're using it to switch small effects devices & on-stage table lamps so not envisaging overload issues.

Yep - no problem. The main reason I mentioned this, is on occasions I have encountered people making custom dimmers/relays featuring domestic 13A sockets, where the cleaner has then come along and plugged the hoover into what they think is a spare 13A socket. Theoretically if this was to happen with your box, this could damage the relay channel, and in an extreme case, dependent on the failure of the relay, could cause a fire. Of course, the likelihood of this happening depends on how accessible your relay panel is!

[Simonkbike]

Hmm, I installed 7.14.2 this week but when I try to re-patch I can't find a non-dim profile.  When I search, I still have a video 1ch profile available.  Any suggestions?

Re fuses: It'll be on the lighting bar so we'll out of reach, but good to check.

S.

[Edward Z88]

10 hours ago, Simonkbike said:

I installed 7.14.2 this week but when I try to re-patch I can't find a non-dim profile.  When I search, I still have a video 1ch profile available.  Any suggestions?

If you search "Non Dim" in Add Fixtures, you should see this...

If you are still seeing the "Video" fixture in Add Fixtures, this suggests the fixture is included in the show file that has been loaded, and so has been added to Add Fixtures. As mentioned, the generic "Video" fixture is not included in Add Fixtures in more recent fixture libraries.

[Simonkbike]

Yeah, it's there today.  Yesterday I searched "non" & got nothing, but I must have mis-typed.  Sorry.

S.

[Edward Z88]

8 minutes ago, Simonkbike said:

Yeah, it's there today.  Yesterday I searched "non" & got nothing, but I must have mis-typed.  Sorry.

No problem - let us know if there's anything else we can help with.

[Simonkbike]

For clarity, if you patch a new fixture. non dim profile is in the Generic list as expected.

When I was re-patching my existing fader, the Generic list is filtered, hence "non dim" is hidden even to a Search.   Once I'd pressed Clear Filter, all was revealed.

S.