K-Nine

So the 9 pages (soon to be 20 pages) of 24 submasters is not sufficient for your needs on the Bull Frog then :evil: Using the Brightness button to change the channel flash buttons to SX buttons probably would work, as far as outputting the SX buttons goes However, the problem is, that for the user interface and software to be consistent across the entire frog range (and anything else would be asking for trouble), you would also need an SX button like on the Mambo Frog, which is used to display the SX screen on the LCD/Monitor and is required when programming/editing the SX buttons 8O

Partial programming is probably most applicable on submasters, where you only want certain fixtures or attributes of fixtures (eg brightness, colour, beamshape or position) to be programmed and output. The 'tagging' mechanism is the way of indicating to the user which fixtures will be recorded into the memory or submaster data, when you press the program button.

I can't think of an obvious solution at the moment The Mambo Frog has two extra physical buttons on the front panel called SELECT ALL and CLEAR ALL which were added since fixture selection and tagging is spread over 4 pages of 24 fixtures.

The SX Buttons on the Mambo Frog serve two main purposes: 1. They are SX buttons, which are essentially faderless submasters. Channel and fixture data can be loaded directly onto them or memories transferred onto them in exactly the same way as submasters. The action of each button determines how the data is output when the SX button is pressed. 2. They are used as the palette selection/output buttons in exactly the same way that the channel flash buttons are used on the other desks in the frog series. Edit: Woh, just realised that this is my 500th post ... think I'll have a coffee to celbrate

You can also untag multiple fixtures using the same method as tagging them, ie press and hold down the first fixture selection button and then press and hold down another fixture selection button for approx. 1 second. On the Mambo Frog you can untag all tagged fixtures by pressing and holding the Clear All button for approx. 1 second.

When the new Frog updates package is released, the Phantom Frog software will also be updated to match the new Frog Series software

Which display on the Sirius (250 I assume) ... LCD or monitor ? Aren't all the things you mentioned already displayed on one or more monitor screens :wink: Yes, this is in the next update For details of the next update package see the Software Releases Forum CLICK HERE

Beta software is the name that is given for intermediate or prototype releases of software inbetween official releases. The Beta versions are used when implementeing new or modified functionality and bug fixes and we sometimes make them available to registered Beta testers to try out new and modified functionality etc. This way we can get more testing done on the software than is possible with the limited resources and facilities in-house. The software is also being tested in a more realistic environment with real lighting rigs etc. We welcome feedback and comments from Beta testers as it helps us make the software better and provide the operation and interfaces that the users are looking for. I will add you to the Beta Test Usergroup. When a Beta version of software is available you will be notified.

Would you care to verify your first comment ? I'm not sure exactly how the Pearl desk handles palettes, but we have designed a locking mechanism for the palettes, which will be in the updates package currently in development. This is mainly because we have to design the new functionality based around the existing front panel controls. The Sirius 250/500 had separate sections of buttons for the colour/beamshape/position memories (palettes) and the focus submasters which could be programmed with combinations of C/B/P memories. We are adding locking palettes in the next update. Whether we extend this to include combinations of C/B/P palettes into "focus subs" in a later version is a decision for the management and sales departments. Not sure I follow what you are asking for here exactly.

All registered members in this forum will be emailed when the new updates package is released. If we decide to release one or more interim Beta releases, then those members who are registered as Beta testers will be informed of where they can download the Beta software.

What type of chase were you running on the submaster with the 4 heads (colur, position). Note that when you record any memory/submaster data in partial mode that the HTP channels (generic dimmer channels and fixture brightness parameters) are always recorded, regardless of the tagged state of the fixtures. If the brightness for the heads was not recorded as part of the chase then where would it be coming from ? The yellow LEDs in the submaster flash buttons indicate that the data being output on that submaster is from a diffferent page to that indicated by the seven segment display. When the submaster fader is brought down to zero, the LED goes off and the sub then contains whatever data may be programmed for the current page.

Firstly, the Fat Frog desk is specified with 12 moving fixtures. If you wish to run more fixtures from the desk, you can control two or more fixtures of the same fixture type from one 'fixture' on the desk by setting their DMX start addresses to the same values. Obviously this will result in the fixtures all having the same outputs. If you want individual control of more than 12 moving light fixtures, then you may want to consider the Leap Frog which has 24 fixtures, or the Mambo Frog which has 96 fixtures. This point was also raised in one of the other forums by another user. CLICK HERE I suggest you have a look at the responses, particularly the one from NZ

I think I'm beginning to follow what you are describing, but whatever method the subs use to calculate the outputs, HTP, LTP or some temporary (?) combination of both (!) it is certainly not a trivial exercise to design, implement and integrate into the current desk software. However, it's certainly a feature we should consider for the next series of desks :wink:

But how does the submaster know what the start point is ? The fixture parameter value could have been set last by the playback X, another submaster, sx button, control wheel, palette output etc. 8O Surely, the only way you could do this sensibly would be to scale the programmed value of the fixture parameter in the submaster data along the full travel of the submaster fader. For example, If the submaster data had a colour wheel value of 160 DMX programmed, the output value of the colour wheel cf submaster fader position would be as follows: Submaster @ zero colour wheel value = 0 Submaster @ 10% colour wheel value = 16 (DMX) Submaster @ 50% colour wheel value = 80 (DMX) Submaster @ 100% colour wheel value = 160 (DMX)

I can see what you are getting at, but I am not sure how we could do this easily, it will require some more thought :? You say "in a HTP style" but presumably the outputs of the fixture parameters such as colours and gobos etc. would still be calculated on an LTP basis as they are elsewhere on the desk (control wheels, playback X, submasters, SX buttons) ? Afterthought: Not exactly the same as using a sub but ... couldn't you just select the fixture(s) you want, select the attribute (eg colour) and then move the control wheel up or down ?

I think what you probably need to do is program a CHASE memory with the number of steps that you want and then transfer the memory onto the submaster. With regard to the wheels, if you edit the fixture personality data using the Fixture Type Editor (available on the Zero 88 website) you can reorganise the fixture parameters within an attribute (eg colour or beamshape). However you cannot have a wheel group that contains parameters from different attributes (eg colour, beamshape and position). Fixtures can only have a single brightness parameter which is assigned to the first finger wheel. Colour and beamshape parameters are arranged in wheel groups according to the information in the fixture personality file. With position parameters, Pan and Tilt always appear on the thumb wheel and first finger wheel respectively.

Sounds like a good suggestion to me ... those keys on the external keyboard are not currently used (as far as I know)

The feeling I get from most people on this subject is that all four cursor keys on the external keyboard should move the cursor around the monitor screen and that two other keys (TBD) should be used to adjust the value of the selected field.

The next update package includes features that apply to the generic channels as well as those which are specific to fixtures ... I will add you to the Beta Testers

Frog Reference No 5459 - C/B/P states on monitor screen do not match those on the main LCD when editing memories - Bug to be fixed in next update package. Having checked this on a desk here, it would appear that the data on the main LCD is correct and that on the monitor screen is wrong - so I can see how this could be confusing :?

This will probably depend on whether the desk is in full or partial mode. In full mode, it should be possible since all channels and fixture data is automatically recorded on pressing the Program button. It may be possible in partial mode but you would have to ensure that as well as raising the submaster to obtain the correct output data, that the correct fixtures are tagged and the correct attributes selected when pressing Program. I don't think there is a simple way of transferring submasters to memories at the moment, but I think it has been logged as a feature to be reviewed.

I think I have explained elsewhere in the forums that the submaster fader is responsible for controlling the HTP data on the submaster (ie the generic channels and fixture brightness parameters). The LTP data (fixture colour, beamshape and position parameters) is triggered when the fader passes through the trigger point. The Colour, Beamshape and Position data can be set to snap or fade, and if fade will use the LTP fade time for the memory. I think this only works for memories transferred onto subs at the moment, but this will be extended to data programmed directly onto subs in the next update package

You can program fixture channel data directly onto submasters, or program a memory (scene or chase) and transfer it onto a submaster fader. If you use the desk in partial mode, you can program memory and submaster data down to fixture and attribute level (eg a submaster could just affect the colour, beamshape or position parameters of certain 'tagged' fixtures).

The download section of the Zero 88 website normally only contains the latest operating software version for each desk. I'm sure we could provide you with an earlier version if it proved necessary.

Richard is quite right, you can run moving lights on an Illusion 120/240 on a channel by channel basis, but the interface is not really designed for moving light contol ..... however the the Illusion 500 with the new moving light software certainly is :wink: